Redken Extreme Mask/Colorful Neutral protein Filler.

It should be fine! That's a lot of protein though, just be sure your hair really needs all of that. If it does seem like it's over proteined (brittle, hard, very dry), just give it a quick shampoo and moisturize it well after

It should be fine! That's a lot of protein though, just be sure your hair really needs all of that. If it does seem like it's over proteined (brittle, hard, very dry), just give it a quick shampoo and moisturize it well after

Hiya katiesiepierski

Thanks for the reply. I typically follow a protein treatment with a deep moisturising treatment. After I've rinsed, I apply a few drops of oil (Using Redken Diamond Oil atm which is brill) to seal in the moisture. Protein treatments have never been drying on my hair, quite the opposite actually, I've found them to be a good way of making my hair retain more moisture which is always a bonus.  *yay*

EDIT: I've slightly changed the wording in this reply because I feel my original message come across as quite douchey. So sorry for that  *boo*

Hmm... thanks for asking Scotty... I've never thought of it actually. I'll think of trying it out, thanks!

Hmm... thanks for asking Scotty... I've never thought of it actually. I'll think of trying it out, thanks!

Thanks. Have you tried the Redken mask, specifically the Strength Builder Plus version? I absolutely love it. Ideally I would prefer to use Joico K-PAK DPR but it contains mineral oil which is a bit too heavy for me.

You're lucky to be able to use that much protein. If I use it even a little bit too much my hair is straw.

I actually use Joico k-pak dpr religiously since november last year 🙂 I think it works, kind of, my ends felt gummy, and after couple of times of using joico's k-pak + coconut oil it just felt like regular hair ! I'll think of giving redken mask a go! But lately I was just thinking of taking a shortcut and coming back to sillicones.. 😡 I know they're just an illusion but I think they might be effective when it comes to mechanical damage, I don't bleach my hair too often

You're lucky to be able to use that much protein. If I use it even a little bit too much my hair is straw.

Sounds like you could have low porosity hair?

Yeah Redken's Extreme Line is brilliant! Have you used their Chemistry Shot Phase treatments at all? There's an Extreme one, that's my favorite, it seems like it's just a combination of all the other ones + it gives the best results.

@crowcrow I'm totally with ya on the silicones! They do seem to help prevent a lot of mechanical damage from tangles/brushing/combing. In the winter with the cold/ dry air, it seems like they help keep the moisture in your hair better too. With my hair being bleached it loses moisture more quickly than when it wasn't bleached, but if I put a conditioner with silicones on my hair last (after coconut oiling/cone free conditioning ,etc) it stays moist for much longer

Just a quick "thanks" for this thread because I'm going to look into these fillers, exactly what I was after on this thread, used to use them in the US all the time, especially before colouring.  My hair never gets over-proteined either, perhaps it is because it is naturally curly/kinky and would be frizzier without the keratin I use.

I've also gone back to using silicones.  I mean, they are in nearly every conditioner on the market so they're certainly for hair-use, it's not like they're a foreign or fake substance you stick in your hair.  I thought I may as well add some shine and silkiness to my hair and enjoy it rather than putting up with drier-looking hair that I could say was "free of silicones".

In fact after being silicone-free for a few months then going back to them, even when I clarify or use bleach now, my hair feels much better than it did when it was completely silicone-free, I don't really understand why!  So they do protect the hair somehow, not from bleach damage of course, but as you've mentioned from everyday damage, and that must make a huge difference.

So silicones really aren't that evil 😀

Just a quick "thanks" for this thread because I'm going to look into these fillers, exactly what I was after on this thread, used to use them in the US all the time, especially before colouring.  My hair never gets over-proteined either, perhaps it is because it is naturally curly/kinky and would be frizzier without the keratin I use.

I've also gone back to using silicones.  I mean, they are in nearly every conditioner on the market so they're certainly for hair-use, it's not like they're a foreign or fake substance you stick in your hair.  I thought I may as well add some shine and silkiness to my hair and enjoy it rather than putting up with drier-looking hair that I could say was "free of silicones".

In fact after being silicone-free for a few months then going back to them, even when I clarify or use bleach now, my hair feels much better than it did when it was completely silicone-free, I don't really understand why!  So they do protect the hair somehow, not from bleach damage of course, but as you've mentioned from everyday damage, and that must make a huge difference.

So silicones really aren't that evil 😀

I agree with you. I'm currently silicone free but tbh i might start using again and just make sure they're water soluble. I get more softness and shinier finish with silicone. I miss them!

I personally feel like silicones aren't that bad. If I use too much of them my hair will look a bit flat quite quickly, but in moderation, I feel like they're the best bonder for hair.

Of course we can try the healthy methods like protein treatments and hydrating treatments but a.) they're a lot more time and energy consuming b.) more expensive in the long run c.) in all fairness, at the end of the day, hair coated with silicone may be stronger than a natural one as once bleached, always damaged

I'm thinking of going 50/50 at the moment. Introduce a bit of silicones from drugstore hair masks, that tend to have a mix of silicones and protein in them.

Thanks Scotty for posting, you taught me sth new!!

I personally feel like silicones aren't that bad. If I use too much of them my hair will look a bit flat quite quickly, but in moderation, I feel like they're the best bonder for hair.

Of course we can try the healthy methods like protein treatments and hydrating treatments but a.) they're a lot more time and energy consuming b.) more expensive in the long run c.) in all fairness, at the end of the day, hair coated with silicone may be stronger than a natural one as once bleached, always damaged

I'm thinking of going 50/50 at the moment. Introduce a bit of silicones from drugstore hair masks, that tend to have a mix of silicones and protein in them.

Thanks Scotty for posting, you taught me sth new!!

I understand exactly what you mean. I've learnt that with some ingredients less is definitely more despite what the instructions say 🙂 I used to use a leave-in oil by Kerastase called Elixir Ultime (very popular and has won many awards) which made my hair so incredibly soft and smooth. Very expensive stuff but it lived up to the hype. I now realise that I was using way too much of the it because my hair would look nice and smooth on day 1 but then the next day it was very greasy and a bit of a state tbh. I'm sure it was the silicone content in the ingredients but I was using far too much. I haven't checked but I'm desperately hoping the silicones in that product are water soluble because I want to start using it again but this time I will use it sparingly. 

You seem to have lots of amazing knowledge that's additionally supported by you being very knowledgeable of many products! Tell me your hair life story lol. I wanna know everything!

You seem to have lots of amazing knowledge that's additionally supported by you being very knowledgeable of many products! Tell me your hair life story lol. I wanna know everything!

Thank you for saying that, I'm flattered. Truth be told, I'm a bit obsessed with hair care and all the different ingredients used. Nowadays I like to approach the subject from a more scientific angle rather than how I used to when I was younger by just blind testing things and hoping for the best. I think we're all like that in here to some extent. I enjoy sharing what I've learnt and equally learning from others.

I don't have a hair history that consists of tonnes of different styles and colours like so many here, tbh it's all a bit meh. The most daring colour I ever went was a plum purple back in 2008 but I just didn't have the confidence so I bleached it out and it went pale yellow with a slight pink hue. I've been bleaching my hair blonde on and off since I was 16 and recently stopped because I didn't have a clue and most of the time I ended up over processing my hair and under conditioning it which led to constant breakage and all manner of issues, not to mention I didn't even know about toner. I once over processed my hair with bleach so many times that when I rinsed it out, it disintegrated and then melted in the bath! the scraggly bits that were left were hanging on for dear life. That was a turning point and from then on I stopped bleaching/coloring it, shaved my head then grew it back and went on a "healthy hair journey" and decided that maintaining the condition and style was more important above all else. I will never say never but atm I like my natural virgin hair and it doesn't melt when I rinse it.